And I don't care again.

Umm hello? Let's direct the focal point of this thread back towards the most important matter of the day: me and my triumphant return.

Let me ask you this, Dana. Why does your peacemaker attitude and general understanding of people's base emotions and problems only surface when coming to the aid of some sad person? Are not those of us who don't take crap worthy of the same sort of thought?

Yeah. Thought so. It's all an illusion, and a sad playground, where you think it makes you look good to be noble. Noble, no. Not one bit.

Oh, my ping dingleschmutz -t is returning replies!

once again in engrish, please?

What is that, a riddle? It hurts my head...

Well that was deserved I'm sure.

@ Dingle: Yey! You're back!

Let's see: a long-time poster has a problem with another poster. First poster finally says what's on her mind. First poster gets a smartass comment from someone she's never even been aware of before. First poster gets mad. First poster doesn't like being backed into a corner. First poster hates even more being ignored UNLESS SHE'S CRYING OR ANGRY.

On the other hand, and newbie comes along and screams at YOU for trying to help, screams at UT for trying to help, and you find it in your heart to try to see where it's coming from, and coddle and reassure.

BigV has been a BigAss for a long time, and I don't care if no one likes my words like acid hate: I only put up with shit for so long.

what should hurt your head is assembling the most expensive squad in history and "borrowing" a coach from another organization... and still celebrating the FA cup like it was your real target all along. ;)

Honestly, Shaw, I think this is unpleasant to watch. That's all. Do I think you have a point? Yes, I do. I just think this is probably the least productive and most unpleasant way of dealing with/expressing that. Do I think Daffodil jumped feet first into something that's been brewing for months? yes, I do. But I think your response to him was over the top.



What I think, however, is irrelevant.

That was *precisely* LJ's complaint.

Aww, you remembered! We had to have something to celebrate, since UEFA decided to take away our chance at the silverware we really wanted through a shoddy referee appointment.

How did Arsenal's trophy case end up looking this year? ;)

what was UT?

S123 said people who she thought were her friends did not back her up. That was (part of) LJ's complaint.

exactly like what I thought it would at the end of last summer. Now sell Adebayor and Diaby and buy Lorik Cana and Hangeland and we'll take the league and CL next year. *not holding my breath*

Blame UEFA all you want. Or you could look at your tactics in the first 179 minutes. The ref sucked but you leave it chance when you choose not to play with only a one goal lead.

I kinda thought he had it covered. Maybe I assume he has thicker skin than he has.

That was largely my first response.

[later, I wrote this to LJ on "real" friendships and the forums] [edits I would make since in bracket]

[are we friends?] Well I'm pretty fucked up, I'm a dedicated anti-social and have like three friends.

The Cellar folks are not [precisely] friends, but I don't [necessarily] expect the forums to produce genuine friendships [; it produced a marriage, so it surely can happen, but people don't necessarily convert "cellar friends" into "real" friends]. And yet the [forums] have a social function that is very friend-like. It produces genuine fulfillment, for many people, in many ways. There's great value to that. Sociologists haven't really defined it all yet, but what we are doing is creating new ways to be social and link to one another and care about one another. It may not be as deep as friendship. But not as deeply disappointing as friendship either...

I care about you man. I guess we're not friends in the traditional sense of the word. But you're a part of me that I value. A funny guy with an interesting life and beautiful family. I would do an awful lot for you. We're E-friends is what.

Hi! I've been gone for a week, and I come back to this? wow...but I definitely agree with UT's above post - E-Friends.

I've been telling the SO about the Cellar for a while - he finally decided to check it out, then got upset when he saw that it was more than "How 'bout them Lakers." Guess he didn't know you really can have such a thing as E-friends, and when you're happy or sad or need an opinion it's a nice place to turn and get usually unbiased opinions or input. I like the blatant honesty - I don't always agree, and I don't necessarily "like" everyone in here, but I take what I want and leave the rest.

Thanks for being here Cellar.

Great insights, UT.

I've analogized forums as talking to a person with three dozen split personalities. Sometimes they're witty, sometimes they're helpful, sometimes infuriating... It's like the magic eight ball. If you don't like the answer, walk away and "try again" later.

Thats where I think that some people thought differently. The things that I have seen happen on/through the cellar and the level of caring/concern/friendship seemed to have transcended from the simple online or e-friend. There have been many things done which caused me to think so, in my limited online experience anyway.

Just think of some of the ways that cellarites have banded together to help each other out. Some of the things that were done IRL for others who needed it.
Fer FOOKS SAKE - a car the donations to various people when down the collage ... Maybe all that happens on other forums, I dunno, but I doubt it.
That perception, real or imagined, led me to believe that the cellar was unique, different, special in some way. FWIW, I now realize I was wrong.

I think the friendships formed here are real friendships...they just exist in a different way and follow different 'rules'.

oh wow. well, umm, thanks for proving me wrong there S123.

oh, and FYI: I have met V. Didn't get the same impression as you. That is neither here nor there. Just my personal judgement (fairly well honed from years of working outreach in some scary areas, as well as having amassed a bunch of trust worthy friends, thus creating a sense of what we call "context") being different from yours.

That being said, I find it fascinating that I can not read a whole thread, comment on your post, which offends me, and get reamed for
a: being new (oh no! the horrors of being "new")
b: telling you what I think

and again, the irony of throwing a zillion insults at me for pointing out that you sidestep a point with namethrowing.

It's not making you look right. It's making you look mean.

That being said: I am somewhat new around here. You are right. But you know what this is a fucking BBS. Not a bar. Most people don't even know eachother, except through reading eachothers posts. So READING THREADS gives me familiarity I might not be able to gain in other social situations.

Also, I am new around here, so I am noticing trends in bulk. Trends like you thinking that you "tell it like it is" when in reality you just insult the fuck out of people to get a rise.

Also, oh did I mention this: I am new around here. And I am quickly choosing to not be old around here.
So you get your wish. Congrats you win.
Your prize,me on your level:

I will trot back to my fantasyland as it will, otherwise known as other internet communities that let me increase my overall knowledge and perspective by engaging in funny and informative conversations that keep the shit throwing and defensive posturing to a minimum.

Oh, and one more thing, a bonus just for you, especially for you S123:
FUCK YOU. You are a cunt. Clearly insecure. Clearly incapable of reading a post for content and not for the opportunity to pounce. You are, based on posts, clearly not smart enough to interact with people without making fun of them or understanding their actual motives. And for some reason you consider defending sad people a self serving ego fest instead of an instrument of empathy and kindness. Which makes you a very very stupid bitch.

Thank god you're not staying.

You are an instigator, just like your buddy Tiki and your buddy BigV. So guess what? You get what you give.

I'm a stupid cunt? Nice. I'm quite sure you shouldn't have said that.

Remember when this used to be a good place? Shall we go on another safari and bring more assholes back? They're like a fucking jungle disease. They do, however, give BigV someone to hang out with.

Go fuck yourself, daffy-dillweed. You're useless, stupid, and grossly misinformed.

Oh, and for the record. BigV and Tiki ARE psycho, which explains the draw for you.

I don't think that was wrong. I still maintain that the cellar is unique and different and special.


There are two things at play for me. One is actual friendship: there are people in this community I like ad care about and would name on my list of friends in this world. But there's also a wider sense of fraternal connection to dwellars more generally. That transcends my individual likes and dislikes and takes in friends and frenemies alike.

goddammit.


first: fuck you classic for making me read this thread.

2nd. You still don't get it, most of you. it's not about being thin skinned. at all.

3rd. daffodil....shawnee seems to be one of the few people that actually gets what is wrong here. And you don't know who youre talking to. your leaving will go unnoticed. please take mr V with you when you go.

4th. say it with me.....

E




A




bowl of D

um. gee. I can see why no one missed me.

15,000 again.....wiseass mods.

Yes, E A D, daffo.

Hey daff, have you read my 13000-some other posts?

I'm not stupid, I'm not a cunt, and I'm not a bitch. But I don't take crap off people like you, just walking down the street. Never have, never will.

Sorry Jim, thin or thick skinned, maybe wasnt the best way of putting it. Each time I logged in I saw you, or Jinx, or Clod (in the vaccine thread) pretty much slam dunk Tiki's bullshit. I figured you had it covered.

Can't we all just.............oh never mind. I'll be in the Images threads if you need me.

So what?
FALSE - You obviously have no clue.
Ahhh a bit of good news in a post otherwise full of shit.
Take your roommate with you.
That would be PD? lol.

Oh and if I forgot - FUCK YOU.

Can I suggest that we very much don't do any more safaris? It seems to blow a wind of trouble through our doors.

They started it
(They invaded Poland)

lawl worthy beest!

and beest, you're a creepy perv too!


only the fun kind

She's viewing this thread right now......


.....cue creepy tingly music

PD, the internettal virus - kinda like VD.

At one point there were nine dwellars listed and seven of them viewing this thread :P

OK, the friends thing..... There are people I like on here and people I cannot stand (bet you're all surprised to learn that, huh?) I believe that most of that is reciprocal to a certain extent. but whether I like you or not has absolutely no bearing on whether i will agree with you, back you up, stay out of it or rip you a new one when you state your opinion on here. That all depends on what crap/wisdom is eminating from your fingertips, whether I'm here, whether I'm reading that thread, whether I give a fig and whether I think my involvement will have any benefit. and yes, my own amusement is one benefit. If I keep stum it doesn't mean I don't care

I have no idea if most people here feel like this or will back their "friends" regardless of how stupid they're being (friends don't let friends drive drunk....). But that's how I see it.

I try, very much, to stay out of other's arguments/disagreements/flame-fest, what have you. I get too emotional, too revved up and I'm sick of apologizing everywhere to everyone. AND I hate conflict, I really do. I can barely stand up, let alone back up a friend. I hate that I've no spine, but it's easier to just slither away. I get fed up with all the "prove it!" bullshit when it's nearly impossible to prove something about a post a week or month or so ago that you no longer recall IN TOTAL, you only recall the gist of it and I think most people here get the 'gist' of most of the OTHER people here and that's what they go on.

don't like 'em? don't read 'em. They piss you off real bad? Drown them in a shallow pool of goblin piss in your mind and then fuck them with a blazing hot poker. That'll shut 'em up.

I like Shawnee. I like Lj and jinx and dani. I see a lot of valid points on all sides. I don't know daff but I DID get the creepy feeling that Tiki was mari-shit-o in some sort of bizarre reincarnation. The cowboy boots really jelled that up for me.

that said: like the lady who took my police report on the stolen 480.00, "HAVE A NICE DAY!!!"


*wish for gun growing...Growing...GROwing...GROWing...*

I am the same in real life. Also, I'm the last to pick up on what's happening below the surface. People can be all like "Did you see how that waitress treated me totally different than you? How she paused and sneered?" and I'm all like, "Uh, I want eggs."

This drama is hurting my head, and I really do think its hurting the cellar. There are dwellers I don't like, and I can't stand the bullshit they spew, for that reason I try to avoid responding to them, altho I have none on ignore. I have had a clash or two, but I try to reduce the exposure. That's how I am in real life too, probably because I don't want anyone to not like me, even if I don't like them. I'd rather someone I don't like, just not notice me. I'm not suggesting that and dweller avoid conflict with another, but I think the levels it has risen to is a bit ridiculous on ALL sides.
I think this community has unique properties. Even the people I do not like, I do not necessarily wish them gone. At some point I did, but I realize that even though they might not have any input that interests me personally, other dwellers might enjoy their input. I am a bit confused by this conflict, even if I do know the source, I don't understand why it has become to such...bitterness. It permeates almost all the threads, with uncalled for snide remarks, insults ect. I wouldn't be surprised if most dwellers, oldies and newbies are tired of it. It needs to stop, some mature resolution needs to be reached.

Yes, I'm trying to play the annoying peacemaker. I want peace. Of course I realize I'm still relatively "new" and not a frequent poster, so ignore me if you want.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again.

Seriously though, this has been a big storm in a teacup surely?

And aren't we grown ups? Who needs their friends to back them up in an internet war of words? lol It's not like you might end up being physically harmed...unless someone tells you to go hang yourself and you do...and then who's fault is it? Hmmm...maybe I should put that in the navel gazing forum...anyway, seriously. Come on!

btw, I'm with monster on this one. Stranger things have happened though I'm sure. :)

One last thing...who ran cicero off?

Oh and welcome back p-jinx!

Oooops....here's cic!
http://cellar.org/showpost.php?p=570476&postcount=4111

lol...do people always have to be 'run off'? Can't they just stop posting because they've got other things to do? Sometimes I see less of my real life friends because other shit gets in the way. Isn't it the same online?

If you don't see the difference between backing your friend's stupid argument that you don't personally agree with - and backing your friend against someone declaring them to be a bad person... meh. What's the point then?

Whether it's tiki or V or RichLevy or whatever person of the week who decides to shit all over my husband, point out how much they dislike him, or call him A BAD FUCKING PERSON - I'm done with it. No, Jim doesn't need anybody to back him up - he doesn't need to waste his time entertaining you fuckers who just take, take, take and take some more either.

You don't have to agree with your "friends" about everything - you also don't have to be condecending and shitty. You don't have to be constantly trying to score points. You don't have to take pride in not giving a shit about the words on the screen while patting yourself on the back for belonging to such a caring community.

Thank you Shawnee, for getting it. Not everyone wears their damage on their sleeves, but we're all human beings.

It's only ever been a small handful of people who've taken that stance though Jinx. Most of the time they've got fairly short shrift from most of the rest of us when they've done so.

For the record, I miss you and Jim and hope that you can bring yourselves to be a part of this place still. We've allowed negative shit to fall all over something pretty cool. For my part in that I am sorry.

Yeah, I accept that that's just my perspective Dana, and everyone will see it a little differently. I'm just trying to explain where my head was/is at.... explaining why I just didn't want to read anymore...

That's fair enough m'dear. Just be aware that you are valued here.

jinx, I'm sorry, I just didn't read that thread, I had no idea what was going on until it was all done and dusted. And I still haven't really read it.

I completely see the difference there. I'm not sure how you understood that I didn't. But just because you're my friend doesn't mean you can automatically expect backing when you're being an ass. And again I'm using the word "you" in the general sense, it was a general take on e-friendship.

Aw, you don't need to apologise, no one does. I was venting. It's not 1 thread, it's way more than that.

No, I think some apologies probably are due. I know I have a tendency to try for the peace process when dwellars clash. Occasionally I take my eye off the ball and am too concerned with that peace when, frankly, I should be moving to defend. It is not acceptable for a newcomer to shit all over a friend. Sometimes the meta picture is not as important as what's happening right now.

Don't bite my head off for asking, but what exactly is it that's bothering him then? He had a run in with Tiki and he's upset that UT didn't come to his side and BigV pissed him off. Is that it, or can you elucidate a little more, because I am having a hard time figuring out what the problem is and if I am, then there's probably a number of others who are also.

Is it that he's feeling unappreciated?

lol...Dana, do you realize you're doing exactly what Shawnee jumped all over you for? Trying to keep the peace. ;)

Perhaps it was the unhelpful juxtaposition of a lack of dwellar unity with a clear case of PD unity.




[eta] @ Ali: *chuckles* yes and no. I am also copping to what she accused me of. She was right. The time for me to step in on that thread was when daffodil insulted her and accused her of something she wasn't guilty of, out of either ignorance of the wider picture, or a sense of loyalty to his/her friends.*


* I am not sure which.

yep well, maybe that's the case.

With regard to that situation, it was clear from the outset that it would only end in tears.

People need to suck it up and learn from the mistake of invading another forum en masse. Of course there's going to be consequences. Did anyone think the people over there were going to just lay down and take it? I mean, come on. Seriously. Think about it.

eta: particularly when it was clear the forum being invaded was full of kooks and drama queens.

Well, in fairness, it didn't start as an invasion. It was a return safari.