July 8, 2010: Fingernailed

What were you thinking MS Lohan?

LINK

Send her to prison, I say!

She is going - 90 days.

Which hopefully means a 90 day moratorium on media coverage of the mess she's made of her life.

(I know)

Awesome! I love today's camera technology.

Better pic.

What about NSFW?

meh

The only difference between many of us and Lindsey is we're not famous, we're a little older and wiser, our parents aren't five kinds of money-grubbing pimps, and we don't have the paparazzi following us around everywhere we go.

Nice to see self-admitted addicts wanting to hang the self-admitted addict.

Compassion abounds.

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Originally Posted by Shawnee123 Compassion abounds.

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Originally Posted by Nirvana What about NSFW?

Truthfully I don't think she thought about her nail design for the court room. I think she did it for the paparazzi to be seen after court when she "got off on more probation."

Not only does she have 90 days in jail after that she has 90 days in rehab. I hope she gets her mind right.

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Originally Posted by glatt You don't think that by showing up in court like that, she's showing contempt for the whole legal system? If she's showing contempt like that, then why should anyone show her compassion? I hope she turns her life around. She's got a lot of talent, and if she can get her act together, it's probably not too late for her. She doesn't seem to give a shit though. It's sad. She's a chip off the old block for sure.

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Originally Posted by glatt You don't think that by showing up in court like that, she's showing contempt for the whole legal system? If she's showing contempt like that, then why should anyone show her compassion?

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Originally Posted by Nirvana Truthfully I don't think she thought about her nail design for the court room. I think she did it for the paparazzi to be seen after court when she "got off on more probation."

Addicts will always try to sneak and bargain and plot and lie and cheat and steal, to get the object of their addiction. That's simple Addiction 101.

When it's a "celebrity" who gets "all the breaks" all of a sudden it is no longer an addict trying every trick in the book to keep using, it is a circus with the spectators throwing tomatoes and crying "YOU GOT EVERY CHANCE YOU PRIVILEGED LITTLE BRAT."

What if it were your child, going through such a monumental struggle against addiction? Do you think your own child should be held to such scrutiny? Why does addiction become that deep dark thing again...because seeing it in "celebrities" means it could be still with us? It's denial that addiction is a disease. It is a disease.

I'm not condoning her actions, I'm saying that this is hardly the time to throw tomatoes at Ms Lohan.

Oh, and by the way. Just you wait until I make my "LEAVE LINDSEY ALONE, BOO HOO" video. Oh hell, it's probably already been done.

Shawnee, you are awesome!

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Originally Posted by spudcon Shawnee, you are awesome!

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Originally Posted by Shawnee123 What if it were your child, going through such a monumental struggle against addiction? Do you think your own child should be held to such scrutiny? Why does addiction become that deep dark thing again...because seeing it in "celebrities" means it could be still with us? It's denial that addiction is a disease. It is a disease.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled century.

snicker.

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Originally Posted by nil_orally Nope - it's a choice. A disease is an illness, like leukaemia, influenza or mumps. Most people do not chose to get a disease.

I agree with Shawnee about not condemning someone because they are addicted to something. We don't know how that began, whether they were tricked or coerced, or just persuaded by a trusted friend or role model.
Having said that, I read years ago that Ms Lohan was a bitch to work with. It seems she hasn't yet found the humility necessary to get help for her problem. Writing fuck you on your fingernails shows where her attitude is. I think 90 days in the slammer and 90 days in rehab may work wonders for her.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5LTPRJqt2z4

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Originally Posted by spudcon I agree about not condemning someone because they are addicted to something.

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Originally Posted by Shawnee123 Addicts will always try to sneak and bargain and plot and lie and cheat and steal, to get the object of their addiction. That's simple Addiction 101. When it's a "celebrity" who gets "all the breaks" all of a sudden it is no longer an addict trying every trick in the book to keep using, it is a circus with the spectators throwing tomatoes and crying "YOU GOT EVERY CHANCE YOU PRIVILEGED LITTLE BRAT." What if it were your child, going through such a monumental struggle against addiction? Do you think your own child should be held to such scrutiny? Why does addiction become that deep dark thing again...because seeing it in "celebrities" means it could be still with us? It's denial that addiction is a disease. It is a disease. I'm not condoning her actions, I'm saying that this is hardly the time to throw tomatoes at Ms Lohan.

I think she gets away with her shit because she's so cute.

Cuteness has killed a LOT of addicts.

Excellent post Sam - many good points

No matter what path an addict takes, they will pay the consequences sooner and later. Those brain cells don't grow back, and the damage to cells will come back to bite you later in life.

Yup. My memory loss is attributed to a very well misspent youth.

When we can point and judge, and roll our eyes in chagrin, we must be diverting attention from our own fucked up choices, and our own misguidance, and say to ourselves "no mishap from shenanigans have ever landed on my doorstep." This must be the most glorious of assertions, whether it is true or not.

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Originally Posted by Brianna I think she gets away with her shit because she's so cute. Cuteness has killed a LOT of addicts.

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Originally Posted by Shawnee123 When we can point and judge, and roll our eyes in chagrin, we must be diverting attention from our own fucked up choices, and our own misguidance, and say to ourselves "no mishap from shenanigans have ever landed on my doorstep." This must be the most glorious of assertions, whether it is true or not.

So when you get a jail sentence, you don't necessarily always end up serving the entire sentence. You can get time sliced off for good behavior, or if the place is crowded, you might get released early.

Think the officials who decide these things will let her out early, now that everyone knows about what her fingernails said in court? I wouldn't be surprised if she served the full 90 days.

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Originally Posted by spudcon and the damage to cells will come back to bite you later in life.

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Originally Posted by Shawnee123 When we can point and judge, and roll our eyes in chagrin, we must be diverting attention from our own fucked up choices, and our own misguidance, and say to ourselves "no mishap from shenanigans have ever landed on my doorstep." This must be the most glorious of assertions, whether it is true or not.

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Originally Posted by monster Orly? .... And where do you stand on mental illness? Burning at the stake?

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Originally Posted by nil_orally Nope - it's a choice. A disease is an illness, like leukaemia, influenza or mumps. Most people do not chose to get a disease.

---Webstirs Dicktionary---

Main Entry: losˇer
Pronunciation: \ˈlü-zər\
Function: noun

1 : a person or thing that loses especially consistently
2 : a person who is incompetent or unable to succeed; also : something doomed to fail or disappoint
3: Lindsay Lohan

I can't wait to make fun of all your kids and revel in their misgivings. Please to list all your friends, family, and associates who are dealing with demons, so that I may point out how horrible they are as humans. Those on the road to recovery need not apply, unless they slip, then the mighty hammer of guilt shall be brought down upon their heads. That'll keep 'em straight.

edit: the girl received fair punishment, that hopefully will get her on the road to recovery. Why are so many so bitter at HER, just another addict in a sea? Because she's a celebrity. Seems silly, disease knows no social status. I suspect an underlying whine "but if I had all SHE has I'd be grateful and oh so responsible." You don't know. You haven't walked a mile in her 4000 shoes. Jealousy.

monster - I have sympathy for LiLo. She's cute and rich and talented - a deadly trifecta for an addict if ever there was one.

I have been forced to watch her slow train wreck of a life and I get no happiness from it. I know I'm an addict - I know I am weak and I know my brain has been warped and habituated due to my own choices (that soon enough weren't 'choices' but 'compulsions')

Lindsay is crying, begging for help IMHO. Even the tips of her fingers are a cry for help. I hope someone is strong enough to give her the help she needs. she NEEDS jail/rehab. She probably needs a bodyguard to protect her from herself.

The girl needs to change her mind, but I can't see where she'd get the determination from. Jail time might be a chance to breath but she needs to do some serious work by herself on herself. She strikes me as too cynical to embrace whatever system "The Man" foists on her. Has there ever been a child actor who didn't have a crack-up?

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Originally Posted by toranokaze All pain suffering and illness can be show as a sequence of choices that doesn't mean someone doesn't need help.

Oh the poor thing - she's an addict.
Take it easy on her.
Its not her fault.
She can't help herself.
Its a disease.
Give her a hug.
.
.
.
.
.
.


STOP ENABLING THE FUCKING BAD BEHAVIOR
before something really terrible happens that affects not only hers, but dozens of other peoples lives as well.... FOREVER.
This can and does end up as a life sentence for completely innocent people.

ETA: for some it is already too late. Perhaps its not for her.
Look at Drew Barrymore for example.

Hypocrite. Of all people.

Oh, yeah, and no it's not about Lindsey. It's not about sympathy. It's about addiction. It's about hitting rock bottom before getting the help you need. Get over yourselves, holier than thou's.

I'm all for killing drunk drivers, but it's not my call.

Look at your own family. Condemn them for their mistakes...forever.

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Originally Posted by Griff The girl needs to change her mind, but I can't see where she'd get the determination from. Jail time might be a chance to breath but she needs to do some serious work by herself on herself. She strikes me as too cynical to embrace whatever system "The Man" foists on her. Has there ever been a child actor who didn't have a crack-up?

classic - for every finger you point at someone else, there are three pointing back at yourself.

No one is coddling LiLo. Not now, anyway. YOU ever spent any time in jail?

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Originally Posted by Shawnee123 Ron Howard.

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Originally Posted by Brianna classic - for every finger you point at someone else, there are three pointing back at yourself. YOU ever spent any time in jail?

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Originally Posted by Griff No shit, how'd that happen?

Think how it would feel if, rather than a huge outpouring of support from family, friends, and even strangers, everyone turned their back on you, called you names, told you to suck it up.

As to the quitting drinking crap, I've heard that a lot, peppered with "oh, I'm having a few beers tonight" if the social atmosphere seemed to call for a couple beers. That's not addiction. That's drink-guilt. Oh, and lying.

I don't blame people for having addictions. I blame people for aiding and abetting their addictions. I don't see Lindsay fighting the good fight.

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Originally Posted by monster if you took the average addict in the street and offered them celeb status, do you think they would clean up their act, or use it to try and get out of the legal consequenses of their actions? Methinks all y'all former addicts are just jealous you didn't have celebrity to add to your arsenal of excuses for your addiction before you got cured. But you'd have used it the same way she tried to if you'd have had it.

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Originally Posted by Pete Zicato I don't blame people for having addictions. I blame people for aiding and abetting their addictions. I don't see Lindsay fighting the good fight.

She doesn't have to fight, Pete. She's on so many medications right now its ridiculous.
She is a media created cash cow. What she needs is to get away from her false friends, dysfunctional family and management team who are more concerned with living off of her than in her own well being. Odds of that actually happening? ZERO.
Then again she is getting advice from her "friends who have already gone to jail, Kim Kardashian and Lane Garrison who killed a passenger in his car while driving drunk.

OH. MY. GAWD.

Too much. I gotta get out of this thread. For christ's fuck.

Shawnee, if I ever start drinking again (God forbid), I want you as my sponsor.

I read this morning that her lawyer quit.

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Originally Posted by classicman She doesn't have to fight, Pete. She's on so many medications right now its ridiculous. She is a media created cash cow. What she needs is to get away from her false friends, dysfunctional family and management team who are more concerned with living off of her than in her own well being. Odds of that actually happening? ZERO. Then again she is getting advice from her "friends who have already gone to jail, Kim Kardashian and Lane Garrison who killed a passenger in his car while driving drunk.

Ha! The media?

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Originally Posted by monster Methinks all y'all former addicts are just jealous you didn't have celebrity to add to your arsenal of excuses for your addiction before you got cured. But you'd have used it the same way she tried to if you'd have had it.

But there is a difference between compassion and enabling, as there is a difference between enabling and stoning ('scuse the pun.) People with support systems (compassion without enabling) are typically more successful. Being ashamed of oneself is a huge symptom (could be chicken AND egg) of addiction, and a real roadblock in not only seeking help, but in stepping forward and making one's way out of the shit.

I agree that "awww, poor poor thing" helps no one. I also think public condemnation helps no one. When one has one's foot in the door, whether by force or by free will, they can best be served by compassion without pity, encouragement without excuses.

I think the system may be enabling her if she is allowed to take one of her prescription drugs. A couple I can see like Zoloft and Adderall but WTF does she need dilaudid ?

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Originally Posted by jinx I think the former addicts just know what needs to be done - they are walking the walk. Compassion doesn't help, even if you keep it up for years, it just makes it easier on the addict to stay addicted.

When all of your compassion is used up, your addict will still be an addict. And while they will have forgiven themselves for all the lying/sneaking/stealing/addict behavior that led you there, they will be angry with you for your lack of compassion.

... and blame you for all the wrongs they've done.

Classic, how can you keep proclaiming what a former addict you are? Just a couple weeks ago you posted about the beers you were drinking. I've heard it time and time again from you, how you've conquered some demons (which as far as I can tell was normal young people partying) then raising a beer in a thread or saying "I don't know, I was drinking beers (or wine) that night."

But yeah, big man is walking the walk, talking the talk, lying the lie. As per usual. Hey, it could all be true, but will you make up your mind what YOUR personal truth is? You don't seem to have much of a handle on it.

And the addict in my life thanked me, still does, for being there for him when he was ready to get out of rock bottom.

I see whining about being prey to an addict as pitiful as pity for the addict themself.

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Originally Posted by jinx ...while they will have forgiven themselves for all the lying/sneaking/stealing/addict behavior that led you there, they will be angry with you for your lack of compassion.

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Originally Posted by Brianna I can only hope she turns it around the way Robert Downey Jr. did - coz that man was effed up before he cleaned it up.

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Originally Posted by monster H (uh-oh is marriage an addiction too?)

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Originally Posted by classicman Then again she is getting advice from her "friends who have already gone to jail, Kim Kardashian and Lane Garrison who killed a passenger in his car while driving drunk.

Drunk drivers are lucky if they don't kill themselves, or their friends, or complete strangers. No argument there.

I am surprised at other addicts who can't have any compassion (yes, even for the sneakiness, the duplicity, the "fuck you" attitude that pervades an addicts mind.) Then again, sometimes people are truly addicts and sometimes it's a way to get attention.

Maybe, and I don't know, once one has come through on the other side there is no memory of what it felt like. Hopefully that is true healing, I would hate to think of it as dry-drunkenness or ostrich-head sand-stuffing.

I don't think Ms Lohan would act so repulsively to get attention: that is a true addict acting out right there. Addicts don't care how ugly you think they look, or how horrible you think they are. They need help, not "poo-poo's" from those who've never dealt with it, or those who think they have but have no idea of the depths addiction can take one to. Or, just can't seem beyond themself to realize that one size doesn't fit all in the timeline, treatment, and realization of addiction. 'Cause that would be the epitome of egocentrism.

I, for one, applaud Bri for her honesty in all her dealings with her demons. I would think that being an innerly honest person would help one truly recover. You DA girl, girl!

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Originally Posted by Sundae Girl Just correcting a fact - Khloe Kardashian was convicted of a DUI, not Kim.

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Originally Posted by Griff No shit, how'd that happen?

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Originally Posted by Brianna Most addicts (including myself) have never forgiven themselves and are their own worst enemy/critic/hater which makes it hard to recover AND the addicted brain LOVES to use this as an excuse. LiLo is afraid - and who wouldn't be? - and it doesn't seem like she has any internal coping mechanisms or reserve (ha! hence the addiction!) so it makes perfect sense for her to throw a tantrum. I can only hope she turns it around the way Robert Downey Jr. did - coz that man was effed up before he cleaned it up.

Lesbian Prison Gangs Waiting to Get Hands on Lindsay Lohan, Inmate Says

that woudl explain why the tabloids want to get her exclusive post prison story. They know something LiLo don't

She won't be in jail more than two dozen days, and won't have contact with Lesbian prison gangs.

So there's no justice?

We should ask whip what the over/under is.

I can't stand her, I hope she gets locked away for a long time. Maybe it will fix her head up being behind bars. I bet she gets treated like a queen in there.

Martha Stewart got treated like a queen because she was nice to her fellow inmates. They liked her. I can't picture Lindsay making friends.

The only difference between Ms. Lohan and my own entitled, miserable, demanding drunks and junkies is the level of income.

I have a quote from PK Dick that I keep taped to the desk.

"Drug use is not a disease, it is a decision, much like the decision to step out in front of a moving. car."

The disease model has screwed up effective treatment for years ... "Oooh, cool, it's NOT my fault. It's my genes, it's my alcoholic dad, it's my spoiled and pampered upbringing." None of those things forced your arm to go up and down to your mouth.

And she needs a new shrink ... no responsible doctor should be prescribing benzos or amphetamines to someone who already has an addictions diagnosis. That's another thing I see far too often. Adderall handed out like candy to speedfreaks.

She's got a whole new career in front of her, anyway ... next season on Celebrity Rehab with Dr. Drew. I look forward to seeing her argue with Tom Sizemore around the pool.

Oh wolf. What the hell do you know about it?
Whats that? You've been working in this field for decades.. .. ..
<crickets chirping>

Yer funny.

We can figure this out.

Points that support the disease model:



Points that support the decision model:

disease:
Some races are immune to alcoholism because of different reactions it causes in them.

decision:
Anyone who successfully follows a lifelong abstinence policy will not be affected.

Wait, what? Are you trying to say that alcohol and drugs cause some kind of "chemical" reaction? The HELL you say! You've got some farfetched ideas young man. Now pull yourself up by your bootstraps and put that crack away, you cuckoo bird!

[quote=wolf;670813]None of those things forced your arm to go up and down to your mouth.[/wolf]

Yeah. The same to fucking fat people, too, who whine about how expensive fresh food is. NOBODY FUCKING FORCED THEM TO EAT AT McDonalds and Wendys and stuff chocolate in their pie holes, did they?? No body forced them to overeat like gluttons - fuck 'em! Let 'em all die of high trigylcerides and HTN, cancer and cholesterol!

Why FFS should insurance co. pay fucking MONEY to have their fucking stomachs stapled????

Right?

Bologna.

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Originally Posted by Brianna Bologna.

disease:
Simply stopping causes serious, negative, sometimes life-threatening physical reactions in almost all addicts.

decision:
There are people who simply decided to stop and therein did so successfully.

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Originally Posted by Brianna Yeah. The same to fucking fat people, too, who whine about how expensive fresh food is. NOBODY FUCKING FORCED THEM TO EAT AT McDonalds and Wendys and stuff chocolate in their pie holes, did they?? No body forced them to overeat like gluttons - fuck 'em! Let 'em all die of high trigylcerides and HTN, cancer and cholesterol! Why FFS should insurance co. pay fucking MONEY to have their fucking stomachs stapled???? Right? Bologna.

Do insurance companies pay to deliver babies? That was your decision!

spexx - quit being an idiot.

Midwives used to deliver babies until doctors (MALE doctors) saw dollar signs and drove them out of business. Now that malpractice is so high for Ob-gyns, they are willing to give the practice back to the midwives.

At any rate - there's no comparison between the issues.

Miss Lohan showed up fashionably late to court today, surprised the judge didn't throw in a contempt citation for that.

Not sure what to make of the maneuvering with Shapiro and the improperly completed form to change attorney of record, though.

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Originally Posted by classicman Oh wolf. What the hell do you know about it? --snip

Chuh. According to TMZ, ole LiLo will get her Adderall and Ambien whilst in the pokey.


What a crock.

Yeh they said she's only gonna be there 14 days as well.
Her Dad was on Larry King last night with his atty.Trying to play the concerned parent card ... AGAIN. I dunno, maybe he really does care about more than just the money.
Still, he spent a lot of time disparaging the mother. Good job - NOT.

He is one of those saying she needs to not be allowed to take ANY drugs, prescription or otherwise.. Which I agree with.

I know, SPUCK. I agree with that as well, but the way he came off on LKL was terrible.

Can you imagine going through some kind of personal hell (those above that sort of thing exempted, of course) and having your father go on tv to tell everyone how this should be done? Were his great ideas how she should be handled in PLACE of the bad parenting, or just an addendum? No wonder the girl is fucked up. Thanks for the support, daddio.

Like any good CEO, he's taking charge of damage control, and trying to get his cash cow back in the black.

That's true, and I know it happens a lot, but the naive side of me is really sad to think of horrible awful parents.

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Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce ...trying to get his cash cow back in the black.

And here we go again... Daddy has been arrested for attacking his girl friend.. sigh

Families that play together stay... that way

From CNN ...

What a crock. They should have kept her in for her entire sentence. The special treatment celebrities get makes me sick. She was in just long enough to give the appearance of NOT getting special treatment.

It's completely normal, actually, for such sentences to be cut short.

But complain more, guys, there is so much to be outraged about here.

You have to ask what serves the community better?
Giving a cell to someone with a DUI from 3 years ago, or allowing someone else within the prison community to spend time in solitary confinement?

I'm not a fan of custodial sentences for minor offences (my "lock her up comment" was tongue in cheek, knowing she had already been sentenced at that point). I think community work serves far better, is cheaper and more useful, and rarely gets cut down to this extent. What would I rather pay for, someone to pick up litter on the streets and have a curfew in their own home for three months, or someone to be housed, fed and clothed by the state for 13 days?

I'm not anti-Lohan.
I'm not unsympathetic to addicts.
I believe in treatment rather than punishment.
I just can't bring myself to care about someone who acts dangerously and then doesn't fulfil reasonable stipulations imposed.

Meh, maybe it's my hatred of people who turn up late or cancel at the last minute.
My reactionary heart believes it should probably be legal to gun them down in the street like the dogs that they are.

See, this is the rub. Many who would profess "why the fuck do I care about some damn 'celebrity'" if say, we were talking about Celebrity A marrying Celebrity B, and would poo-poo the interest in such fluff. However, if for some reason it seems like Celebrity A is getting something over that "normal" citizens do not, all of a sudden it matters a great deal what those previously "who cares about" celebrities do, or don't do.

This has been mostly my crusade in the matter: the hypocrites I speak of could also very well be run down or gunned down like the dogs they are (only I think most dogs are OK, and deserve better treatment.) Really, the tilting at windmills and whine has become tiresome.

Regardless, as I said, this is pretty much the way it works, regardless of who Ms Lohan is or isn't, or whether we like her or not, whether she turns her life around or not. Joe Blow the fuck kid who smashed up a road sign would go through the same process. But we don't hear much about Joe Blow the fuck kid. Joe Blow the fuck kid gets a bit more privacy.

Damn, can you imagine the uproar if there had been interwebz when Marcia Marcia Marcia Brady was a giant cokehead?

I see where you're coming from.
And I get what you mean.
I guess how I feel is that Joe Blow didn't make his money from the media.
So Joe Blow gets privacy.
I fucked up my life in private, so I'll not get a magazine deal out of it.

Having no addiction is FAR better than having no money.
But neither the star nor Joe Blow gets that choice.
She doesn't get to pay to magically (as in Harry Potter) remove her addiction - all the money in the world doesn't make that happen.
But neither does Joe Blow get the money to cope with his.

I don't suscribe to the "I paid your wages!" view.
Having worked in the public sector and as a barmaid it's one that rankles. And I don't believe those that court publicity should have every secret of their lives divulged. Like I said before - if she was drinking herself to death behind closed doors I'd villify any publication that tried to intrude. But once you're already in the judicial system things are pretty much common knowledge. And if millions of people have paid to follow you previously, you can bet more millions will want to watch you fall.

Meh, I don't know where I'm going with this.
Don't hate me because I have a drinking problem, hate me because I'm not a millionaire.

Actor Barry Williams wrote in his book that he was stoned during the filming of this scene:

Damn Joe Blow anyway!

Also, just an aside, think about people coking their heads off at Studio 54 back in the day. Certainly there wasn't the market for the kind of sneaky amateur publicity like there is now, but also...could it have been that we just didn't give as much of a fuck? Have our lives become so freaking "safe" and boring that outrage at Lohan or Lohan-likes gives us something to be passionate about? Of course, I find that a bit sad. I also think that if there were not so many who got their panties in a bunch (as some like to say) about such stupid "how does that affect me again?" crap, then there wouldn't be a market and she wouldn't be plastered all over the supposed "news." National Enquirer, maybe, but when did the whole world start giving such a shit?

eta: UT: I mentioned Maureen McCormick after picking up HER book at Odd Lots (for 3 bucks!) It was about what I expected but I did think at the time where was any scandal surrounding her shenanigans? It just wasn't what it is today. Barry looks stoned, did you see how he was tripping around the bicycle pump?

Groovy, Greg!

You should try reading the daily right-wing tabloids here...
They can froth at the mouth about any subject from Princess Diana, to immigration, to benefits (usually followed by the word "scroungers!") to political correctness to health & safety to... well... just about anything.

It's a new Victorianism.
Which was hypocritical the first time round.
Like no journalist has ever got drunk, snorted coke, had an affair or cheated on their expenses? Ha.

Yeah, like no one expects them to be a "role model."